JSA #6: Timeline completely out of whack

[Duggy]

Up until now, I figured that I could reconsile the Legion timeline to
make this story fit. Not anymore. You have two Legionaires who never
met, and by origin one did not exist until after the other died. So
how can they both be there on the same mission??
And I was so enjoying this story too. Now I think it just jumped the
shark. It is going to take some serious explaining to clear up this
mess.

Because this isn't the Earth-1 LSH... even if they come from the new
Earth-1.

We know that the history of Superman, et al, isn't the same as we
remember.

We've been told that the new Earth-2 is like the old Earth-2 but isn't
the exactly the same.

Why are you assuming that even if this is the original LSH it has to
have the exact same history?

===
= DUG.
===

[Michael]

Post by Duggy

Up until now, I figured that I could reconsile the Legion timeline to
make this story fit. Not anymore. You have two Legionaires who never
met, and by origin one did not exist until after the other died. So
how can they both be there on the same mission??
And I was so enjoying this story too. Now I think it just jumped the
shark. It is going to take some serious explaining to clear up this
mess.

Howzabout:

- Karate Kid was only mostly dead and got better after Jeckie became
Sensor Girl.
- Princess Projectra switched to the Sensor Girl costume but not the
name. She's yet to be referred to as "Sensor Girl", even with the
Interlac "S" clasp for her cape.
- Jeckie was always Sensor Girl.
- Jeckie had a different reason to hide her identity as Sensor Girl.

And so on.

Post by Duggy
Because this isn't the Earth-1 LSH... even if they come from the new
Earth-1.
We know that the history of Superman, et al, isn't the same as we
remember.
We've been told that the new Earth-2 is like the old Earth-2 but isn't
the exactly the same.
Why are you assuming that even if this is the original LSH it has to
have the exact same history?

That's true.

And the alert should've sounded off when the Sensor Girl statue showed
up. And if you really want to be a stickler, Timber Wolf's costume
isn't up to date either. Come to think of it, didn't Karate Kid start
wearing a different costume shortly before he died?

There's a mention by Karate Kid on page five that "they" (Cosmic Boy,
Lightning Lad, and Saturn Girl I presume) risked their lives to save
him. Maybe that's got something to do with it?

Michael

[Dan McEwen]

Post by Michael

Post by Duggy
Why are you assuming that even if this is the original LSH it has
to have the exact same history?

That's true.
And the alert should've sounded off when the Sensor Girl statue
showed up. And if you really want to be a stickler, Timber Wolf's
costume isn't up to date either. Come to think of it, didn't
Karate Kid start wearing a different costume shortly before he
died?

Sort of but not really. The 'costume' was similar to his original,
but for the most part it was just what he wore everyday. And Val
hadn't been a regular member for a few years before he died.

Post by Michael
There's a mention by Karate Kid on page five that "they" (Cosmic
Boy, Lightning Lad, and Saturn Girl I presume) risked their lives
to save him. Maybe that's got something to do with it?

Hmm...so maybe the story did go down exactly the way we saw it in
the LSV story.

[Michael]

Better keep this in racdu as well.

Post by Duggy

Up until now, I figured that I could reconsile the Legion timeline to
make this story fit. Not anymore. You have two Legionaires who never
met, and by origin one did not exist until after the other died. So
how can they both be there on the same mission??
And I was so enjoying this story too. Now I think it just jumped the
shark. It is going to take some serious explaining to clear up this
mess.

Howzabout:

- Karate Kid was only mostly dead and got better after Jeckie became
Sensor Girl.
- Princess Projectra switched to the Sensor Girl costume but not the
name. She's yet to be referred to as "Sensor Girl", even with the
Interlac "S" clasp for her cape.
- Jeckie was always Sensor Girl.
- Jeckie had a different reason to hide her identity as Sensor Girl.

And so on.

Post by Duggy
Because this isn't the Earth-1 LSH... even if they come from the new
Earth-1.
We know that the history of Superman, et al, isn't the same as we
remember.
We've been told that the new Earth-2 is like the old Earth-2 but isn't
the exactly the same.
Why are you assuming that even if this is the original LSH it has to
have the exact same history?

That's true.

And the alert should've sounded off when the Sensor Girl statue showed
up. And if you really want to be a stickler, Timber Wolf's costume
isn't up to date either. Come to think of it, didn't Karate Kid start
wearing a different costume shortly before he died?

There's a mention by Karate Kid on page five that "they" (Cosmic Boy,
Lightning Lad, and Saturn Girl I presume) risked their lives to save
him. Maybe that's got something to do with it?

Michael

[Dave Van Domelen]

Post by Duggy
Why are you assuming that even if this is the original LSH it has to
have the exact same history?

And that, in essence, is the entire problem with this latest
pseudoreboot. They want to pick and choose what elements of the old comics
they'll keep, but don't feel like telling us in advance what those pieces
are. This leads to two main problems.
1) It's a tease. "It's the Levitz Legion! Except not QUITE! Can you
guess what we're going to change? Neenerneener!"
2) Unless there's a massive tome hidden in the DC offices that all
writers are made to read, outlining all this stuff, they're just begging for
another continuity snarl in a few years, as different writers make
contradictory choices for what old stories to keep in the canon. It'll
admittedly take a while for this to build up enough to be a problem, but
unless they're being a LOT more careful than they've given evidence of being,
it'll happen and in ten year's we'll have Transfinite Crisis or something.

Dave Van Domelen, doesn't care for JoeyQ's "continuity, schmontinuity"
alternative either.

[Anlatt the Builder]

Post by Dave Van Domelen
2) Unless there's a massive tome hidden in the DC offices that all
writers are made to read, outlining all this stuff, they're just begging for
another continuity snarl in a few years, as different writers make
contradictory choices for what old stories to keep in the canon. It'll
admittedly take a while for this to build up enough to be a problem, but
unless they're being a LOT more careful than they've given evidence of being,
it'll happen and in ten year's we'll have Transfinite Crisis or something.

Ten years? You're so generous.

The problems are already piling up. Just as a single example - putting
Detective Chimp in a red bubble-town for Year One in Shadowpact, but
having him show up as a colleague of Ralph Dibny in 52, a series that
takes place completely in Year One. Sure, sure, this could be
explained with extraneous time travel (what couldn't?), but as written
it is a continuity error, not against a story that took place in a
slightly different universe N years ago, but current stories right now.

[JLB]

Post by Anlatt the Builder

Post by Dave Van Domelen
2) Unless there's a massive tome hidden in the DC offices that all
writers are made to read, outlining all this stuff, they're just begging for
another continuity snarl in a few years, as different writers make
contradictory choices for what old stories to keep in the canon. It'll
admittedly take a while for this to build up enough to be a problem, but
unless they're being a LOT more careful than they've given evidence of being,
it'll happen and in ten year's we'll have Transfinite Crisis or something.

Ten years? You're so generous.
The problems are already piling up. Just as a single example - putting
Detective Chimp in a red bubble-town for Year One in Shadowpact, but
having him show up as a colleague of Ralph Dibny in 52, a series that
takes place completely in Year One. Sure, sure, this could be
explained with extraneous time travel (what couldn't?), but as written
it is a continuity error, not against a story that took place in a
slightly different universe N years ago, but current stories right now.

Wasn't that taken care of when it was revealed the Fate helmet wasn't
what anyone believed it was? It was Felix Faust. So that could've
been a Faust created illusion to drive Ralph further down the path.
Same as with the semi-resurrected Sue, and the Faust statue blowing
away.

JLB

[YKW '06]

Post by Anlatt the Builder

Post by Dave Van Domelen
2) Unless there's a massive tome hidden in the DC offices that all
writers are made to read, outlining all this stuff, they're just
begging for another continuity snarl in a few years, as different
writers make contradictory choices for what old stories to keep in
the canon. It'll admittedly take a while for this to build up enough
to be a problem, but unless they're being a LOT more careful than
they've given evidence of being, it'll happen and in ten year's we'll
have Transfinite Crisis or something.

Ten years? You're so generous.
The problems are already piling up. Just as a single example - putting
Detective Chimp in a red bubble-town for Year One in Shadowpact, but
having him show up as a colleague of Ralph Dibny in 52, a series that
takes place completely in Year One. Sure, sure, this could be
explained with extraneous time travel (what couldn't?), but as written
it is a continuity error, not against a story that took place in a
slightly different universe N years ago, but current stories right now.

Hell, first issue of SHADOWPACT screwed the pooch with a powered Superman
flying around right after INFINITE CRISIS. Willingham blamed tightened
security around the two events for the gaffe, but there's gotta be
communication between editors that the Big Three are off the board at
that point.

You'd think.

But there wasn't.

And there's sure as hell no "massive tome" detailing anything. I'd be
surprised if there's even a DCU bible being compiled =officially=
covering the minuscule portion of backstory that's already seen print.

(Unofficially, Mark Waid prolly has a basement full of fanboy galley
slaves compiling stuff on vellum by candlelight...)

[Duggy]

Post by Dave Van Domelen
And that, in essence, is the entire problem with this latest
pseudoreboot.

A hard reboot - everything begins again - has its problems. Retelling
of stories, complete removal of everything fans remember, need to keep
current versions for beginning story...

Post by Dave Van Domelen
They want to pick and choose what elements of the old comics
they'll keep, but don't feel like telling us in advance what those pieces
are.

Yeah. It's the problem with soft-reboots. However, if you get too
detailed with what is and what isn't it counted it becomes an
editorial thing, not a story driven thing.

This way a later writer is a little freer to tell the stories they
want.

Post by Dave Van Domelen
This leads to two main problems.
1) It's a tease. "It's the Levitz Legion! Except not QUITE! Can you
guess what we're going to change? Neenerneener!"

Yes. But that happens anyway.

Post by Dave Van Domelen
2) Unless there's a massive tome hidden in the DC offices that all
writers are made to read, outlining all this stuff, they're just begging for
another continuity snarl in a few years, as different writers make
contradictory choices for what old stories to keep in the canon.

Well, honestly, even if everything made explicit is written down,
there is stuff not written down that is important, too.

Say, the Death of Superman is still in. Fine. But that means that
the Eradicator is needed, but if that isn't made explicit, someone may
miss that point.

Post by Dave Van Domelen
It'll admittedly take a while for this to build up enough to be a problem,

Hopefully. But sometimes it is pretty quick.

Post by Dave Van Domelen
unless they're being a LOT more careful than they've given evidence of being,
it'll happen and in ten year's we'll have Transfinite Crisis or something.

I think a crisis every 10 years is acceptable.

Post by Dave Van Domelen
Dave Van Domelen, doesn't care for JoeyQ's "continuity, schmontinuity"
alternative either.

Oh, hell no.

===
= DUG.
===