What LSH comics are there?

[Ken Arromdee]

I haven't been paying attention to most comics and I noticed that the Legion
seems to be appearing in various comics. Has anyone got a list of these,
so I know what to look for? (Both before and after Legion of Three Worlds,
if there were any before. Mon-El appearances count too.)

(Incidentally, I found Legion of Three Worlds impenetrable. It's not
entirely clear when changes to the old Legion are supposed to be retcons,
"what happened to them later", or problems with history, and I didn't start
reading again until the Shooter run a few years ago, so I don't understand
half of the the reboot and threeboot references. Plus I hate the way
Superboy-Prime is used--dammit, he was supposed to be a fan, and in the past
years he's become a way for the writers to call the fans insane.)

[grinningdemon]

Post by Ken Arromdee
I haven't been paying attention to most comics and I noticed that the Legion
seems to be appearing in various comics. Has anyone got a list of these,
so I know what to look for? (Both before and after Legion of Three Worlds,
if there were any before. Mon-El appearances count too.)
(Incidentally, I found Legion of Three Worlds impenetrable. It's not
entirely clear when changes to the old Legion are supposed to be retcons,
"what happened to them later", or problems with history, and I didn't start
reading again until the Shooter run a few years ago, so I don't understand
half of the the reboot and threeboot references. Plus I hate the way
Superboy-Prime is used--dammit, he was supposed to be a fan, and in the past
years he's become a way for the writers to call the fans insane.)

As far as the current version of the Legion is concerned, they have
regular back-ups in Adventure Comcis and soon to be a new Legion
ongoing...Mon-El is currently the lead in the Superman book (and often
appearing in the other Superman books) as well as just having joined
the JLA during Robinson's run...other Legion members are also floating
around the Superman books but so far only in cameo roles...prior to
Lo3W, there was the JLA/JSA crossover arc called the Lightning Saga
that introduced the current version and it was followed up with a
"Superman & the Legion" arc in Action Comics...they have also appeared
in the Superman Secret Origins mini.

The most recent Legion ongoing that ended last year was a different
version and pretty lame throughout other than some decent art...they
were last seen in Lo3W.

My personal favorite is the Abnett/Lanning run from several years back
(that version appeared in Lo3W too)...unfortunately, I don't expect to
be seeing them again anytime soon (que the obligatory rant from OM
about his favorite artist "Ol Scratchy")

[OM]

On Thu, 04 Mar 2010 15:32:48 -0600, grinningdemon

Post by grinningdemon
The most recent Legion ongoing that ended last year was a different
version and pretty lame throughout other than some decent art...they
were last seen in Lo3W.

...The thing I've been noting is that those who vehemently defend the
Waid "Threeboot" debacle turn out to be doing so just to keep from
admitting they wasted their money on the book.

Post by grinningdemon
My personal favorite is the Abnett/Lanning run from several years back
(that version appeared in Lo3W too)...unfortunately, I don't expect to
be seeing them again anytime soon (que the obligatory rant from OM
about his favorite artist "Ol Scratchy")

...What more can I say about "Ol' Scratchy" other than this little
tidbit: Apparently he's aware of my criticism over the years, and all
he had to say was "he's wrong about one thing. I don't use lemons as
head models". Makes me wonder which fruit he *did* use, then.


OM

[grinningdemon]

Post by OM
On Thu, 04 Mar 2010 15:32:48 -0600, grinningdemon

Post by grinningdemon
The most recent Legion ongoing that ended last year was a different
version and pretty lame throughout other than some decent art...they
were last seen in Lo3W.

...The thing I've been noting is that those who vehemently defend the
Waid "Threeboot" debacle turn out to be doing so just to keep from
admitting they wasted their money on the book.

I didn't HATE Waid's run...I think he had some interesting ideas and I
did like the way he handled certain characters (and Kitson was
great)...still, it was disappointing overall and I am still thoroughly
annoyed that it was another reboot...Shooter's run, on the other hand,
was total garbage (other than Manapul's gorgeous art).

Post by OM

Post by grinningdemon
My personal favorite is the Abnett/Lanning run from several years back
(that version appeared in Lo3W too)...unfortunately, I don't expect to
be seeing them again anytime soon (que the obligatory rant from OM
about his favorite artist "Ol Scratchy")

...What more can I say about "Ol' Scratchy" other than this little
tidbit: Apparently he's aware of my criticism over the years, and all
he had to say was "he's wrong about one thing. I don't use lemons as
head models". Makes me wonder which fruit he *did* use, then.

Somehow I knew you'd have something to add.

[OM]

On Fri, 05 Mar 2010 16:46:17 -0600, grinningdemon

Post by grinningdemon
I didn't HATE Waid's run...I think he had some interesting ideas and I
did like the way he handled certain characters (and Kitson was
great)...still, it was disappointing overall and I am still thoroughly
annoyed that it was another reboot...Shooter's run, on the other hand,
was total garbage (other than Manapul's gorgeous art).

...I absolutely don't blame Shooter for how his run turned out, as he
was given explicit instructions to *not* do the right thing and
jettison all of Waid's "Threeboot" crap. He was told to "stay the
course" as they were going to let Johns "unboot" the Legion in some
at-the-time unspecified manner - Legion of 3 Worlds hadn't yet been
pitched when Shooter took over the book, and at that time the only
thing that was confirmed internally at DC was that Johns would
eventually be writing a new Legion book when his schedule freed up a
bit. Taking that into account, as well as the animosity Shooter has
built up in the industry by refusing to take shit off of people, how
his Legion run turned out really suprised nobody. In fact, the only
surprise is that nobody's come forth to admit they were "Justin
Thyme".


OM

[OM]

On Fri, 05 Mar 2010 16:46:17 -0600, grinningdemon

Post by grinningdemon

Post by OM
...What more can I say about "Ol' Scratchy" other than this little
tidbit: Apparently he's aware of my criticism over the years, and all
he had to say was "he's wrong about one thing. I don't use lemons as
head models". Makes me wonder which fruit he *did* use, then.

Somehow I knew you'd have something to add.

..According to the few fans who've broached the subject at the few
cons Coipel has attended - IIRC, he doesn't live in the US, but
somewhere down in South America - he's been aware of my serious
criticisms of his "Legion Lost" work since it first saw print. He was
on Newsarama at the time, and on rare occasions commented on threads,
but *none* of the Legion-based ones. He's not that enamored of me, and
understandably so as I'm not one of his biggest fans either. I'll
admit he's gotten better, but stand by my original assessments of his
"Legion" work. Especially the belief that his instrument of choice was
a dead tooth brush and not even a simple #2 pencil.


OM

[YKW]

Post by OM
On Thu, 04 Mar 2010 15:32:48 -0600, grinningdemon

Post by grinningdemon
The most recent Legion ongoing that ended last year was a different
version and pretty lame throughout other than some decent art...they
were last seen in Lo3W.

...The thing I've been noting is that those who vehemently defend the
Waid "Threeboot" debacle turn out to be doing so just to keep from
admitting they wasted their money on the book.

Shooter's effort to save that mess did prove surprisingly fun (up until
the final issue, anyway).

Post by OM

Post by grinningdemon
My personal favorite is the Abnett/Lanning run from several years back
(that version appeared in Lo3W too)...unfortunately, I don't expect to
be seeing them again anytime soon (que the obligatory rant from OM
about his favorite artist "Ol Scratchy")

...What more can I say about "Ol' Scratchy" other than this little
tidbit: Apparently he's aware of my criticism over the years, and all
he had to say was "he's wrong about one thing. I don't use lemons as
head models". Makes me wonder which fruit he *did* use, then.
OM

If his THOR run is any guide, it's not fruit at all, but popped tennis
balls.
--
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|| ----------- || ------------------------------------ ||
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"It's not that I want to punish your success. [...]I think
when you spread the wealth around, it's good for everybody."

-- The One, 14 Oct 08

[grinningdemon]

Post by YKW

Post by OM
On Thu, 04 Mar 2010 15:32:48 -0600, grinningdemon

Post by grinningdemon
The most recent Legion ongoing that ended last year was a different
version and pretty lame throughout other than some decent art...they
were last seen in Lo3W.

...The thing I've been noting is that those who vehemently defend the
Waid "Threeboot" debacle turn out to be doing so just to keep from
admitting they wasted their money on the book.

Shooter's effort to save that mess did prove surprisingly fun (up until
the final issue, anyway).

The only thing I even remotely liked about Shooter's run was the
subplot with Projectra.

Post by YKW

Post by OM

Post by grinningdemon
My personal favorite is the Abnett/Lanning run from several years back
(that version appeared in Lo3W too)...unfortunately, I don't expect to
be seeing them again anytime soon (que the obligatory rant from OM
about his favorite artist "Ol Scratchy")

...What more can I say about "Ol' Scratchy" other than this little
tidbit: Apparently he's aware of my criticism over the years, and all
he had to say was "he's wrong about one thing. I don't use lemons as
head models". Makes me wonder which fruit he *did* use, then.
OM

If his THOR run is any guide, it's not fruit at all, but popped tennis
balls.

[Ken Arromdee]

Post by grinningdemon
As far as the current version of the Legion is concerned, they have
regular back-ups in Adventure Comcis and soon to be a new Legion
ongoing...Mon-El is currently the lead in the Superman book (and often
appearing in the other Superman books) as well as just having joined
the JLA during Robinson's run...other Legion members are also floating
around the Superman books but so far only in cameo roles...prior to
Lo3W, there was the JLA/JSA crossover arc called the Lightning Saga
that introduced the current version and it was followed up with a
"Superman & the Legion" arc in Action Comics...they have also appeared
in the Superman Secret Origins mini.

Do you have issue numbers?

Post by grinningdemon
The most recent Legion ongoing that ended last year was a different
version and pretty lame throughout other than some decent art...they
were last seen in Lo3W.

If you mean the Shooter one, I was reading that.

[grinningdemon]

Post by Ken Arromdee

Post by grinningdemon
As far as the current version of the Legion is concerned, they have
regular back-ups in Adventure Comcis and soon to be a new Legion
ongoing...Mon-El is currently the lead in the Superman book (and often
appearing in the other Superman books) as well as just having joined
the JLA during Robinson's run...other Legion members are also floating
around the Superman books but so far only in cameo roles...prior to
Lo3W, there was the JLA/JSA crossover arc called the Lightning Saga
that introduced the current version and it was followed up with a
"Superman & the Legion" arc in Action Comics...they have also appeared
in the Superman Secret Origins mini.

Do you have issue numbers?

Not off the top of my head...it's a lot of books...they've been
turning up pretty regularly in all the Superman books since that
"Superman & the Legion" arc in Action a couple years back...Mon-El
especially since the New Krypton stuff started.

Post by Ken Arromdee

Post by grinningdemon
The most recent Legion ongoing that ended last year was a different
version and pretty lame throughout other than some decent art...they
were last seen in Lo3W.

If you mean the Shooter one, I was reading that.

That's it...there is a new one on the way from Paul Levitz...and he'll
alos be doing Legion stories for Adventure Comics.

[Rob Jensen]

Post by Ken Arromdee
I haven't been paying attention to most comics and I noticed that the Legion
seems to be appearing in various comics. Has anyone got a list of these,
so I know what to look for? (Both before and after Legion of Three Worlds,
if there were any before. Mon-El appearances count too.)
(Incidentally, I found Legion of Three Worlds impenetrable. It's not
entirely clear when changes to the old Legion are supposed to be retcons,
"what happened to them later", or problems with history, and I didn't start
reading again until the Shooter run a few years ago, so I don't understand
half of the the reboot and threeboot references. Plus I hate the way
Superboy-Prime is used--dammit, he was supposed to be a fan, and in the past
years he's become a way for the writers to call the fans insane.)

Basically, of the New-Boot Legion, all you really need to know:



NEW OLD LEGION: If you've been getting all of the Superbooks,
including Supergirl, since Chris Kent was introduced *and* Countdown,
Final Crisis & Lo3W and now Adventure Comics, you've basically got all
of the appearances of the new version of the Legion. Yes, there are a
significant number of books in this generalization that don't include
the Legion, but even then, as tight as the continuity has been on the
Superman books since OYL, even the issues and storylines that they
aren't in are significant background and/or set-up for the current
stories. They're so involved in the overally New Krypton Arc since
OYL and since the return of Brainiac.



MON-EL: Mon-El has had his own storyline as the star of the Superman
title until they all converged in the current "Last Stand of New
Krypton," but there was a little spill-over between Superman and
Action and Supergirl from time to time as Mon and Kara separately got
caught up in Nightwing & Flamebird's storyline and vice-versa.

So, basically, a good jumping-on point would be all of the following
starting with their One Year Later issues:


I. Four Core Superman Family series:
Action
Adventure Comics
Supergirl
Superman


Another shorthand way would be to read these three trade
paperbacks/HCs

LAST SON
SUPERMAN AND THE LEGION OF SUPER-HEROES (Starts with Action #858)
BRAINIAC

then jump into the four core Superman titles where these left off, but
also being sure to read all of the following titles from their first
issues, which are all core to understanding Legion:

II. Associated Series, Mini-Series and One-Shots:
Adventure Comics
Countdown (for the Espionage Squad, esp. Karate Kid and Una)
Final Crisis
Final Crisis: Lo3W
Superman: Last Stand of New Krypton
Superman's Pal, Jimmy Olsen Special #1,2 (Tellus appears)
Superman: World of New Krypton (becomes Last Stand)

Be sure to follow everything listed in both sections above (except for
Countdown, Final Crisis and Lo3W, which have their own numbering
systems) via the return of the Carlin Era's "Superman Shield"
numbering system, which they reinstated right around the time of the
Brainac storyline.

Also, less important regarding the development of the New Legion are
Starman Thom Kallor's appearances in Justice Society and, waaaay back
when, the Starman (Jack Knight) series. You really *don't* need to
read any of Starman's appearances pre-Countdown because they're of
little direct consequence other than to know that his return was part
of the Espionage Squad's current mission to our time. It's just that
various members of the Espionage Squad arrived in our era at different
relative times and in different contexts. His appearnaces in JSA are
most valuable in illustrating that he's schizophrenic (always has
been) and we just aren't advanced enough to have his medication (a
full-on pharmaceutical cure).

-- Rob

[Ken Arromdee]

Post by Rob Jensen
NEW OLD LEGION: If you've been getting all of the Superbooks,
including Supergirl, since Chris Kent was introduced *and* Countdown,
Final Crisis & Lo3W and now Adventure Comics, you've basically got all
of the appearances of the new version of the Legion. Yes, there are a
significant number of books in this generalization that don't include
the Legion, but even then, as tight as the continuity has been on the
Superman books since OYL, even the issues and storylines that they
aren't in are significant background and/or set-up for the current
stories. They're so involved in the overally New Krypton Arc since
OYL and since the return of Brainiac.

I have basically been reading nothing DC since a few years into the Zero
Hour reboot and only started again with the new Shooter run and the Lightning
Saga. I've amassed quite a few back issues of the reboot and threeboot, but
I haven't read most of them and phrases like "return of Brainiac" and "Chris
Kent" mean nothing to me.

I've been drifting away from comics for a long time, the causes being low
value, lack of space, and the fact that comics are in continuous crossover.
The only titles I've been getting regularly are Shooter LSH (until it ended),
Spider-Girl, and X-Men Forever, which I just dropped (plus Dr. Who magazine
and Alter Ego magazine). And it looks like the continuous crossover problem
is just getting worse and has taken over LSH.